ATU564 – ASL and the BMV with Stephanie Richie, Jennifer Alka, Olivia Wascher and Sophia Wascher

Bridging Apps: https://bridgingapps.org/

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—– Transcript Starts Here —–

Stephanie Ritchie:
I’m Stephanie Richie. I’m the director of Deaf Community Services, which is a division of Easterseals Crossroads.

Jennifer Alka:
Hi, I’m Jennifer Alka, and I’m a case manager here at Deaf Community Services.

Sophia Wascher:
Hi, I’m Cynthia Wascher. I go to the [ deaf school 00:00:16].

Olivia Wascher:
Hi, there. I a. Olivia Wascher. I am also here at the [inaudible 00:00:20].

Speaker 5:
And this is your assistive technology update.

Josh Anderson:
Hello and welcome to your Assistive Technology Update, a weekly dose of information that keeps you up to date on the latest develop in the field of technology designed to assist individuals with disabilities and special needs. I’m your host, Josh Anderson with the INDATA Project at Easterseals Crossroads in beautiful Indianapolis, Indiana. Welcome to episode 564 of assistive technology update. It’s scheduled to be released on March 18th, 2022. On today’s show, we have a very full house. We have special guests, Jennifer Alka and Stephanie Ritchie from Deaf Community Services here at Easterseals Crossroads as well as Olivia and Sophia Wascher, who are both students at the Indiana School for the Deaf. And they’re going to talk about a big project that they did kind of during COVID. And the problem that they saw was that the written test at the Bureau of Motor Vehicles to get your driver’s license wasn’t really accessible.

Josh Anderson:
So they set out and actually made it available in sign language. And they’re on to tell us kind of all about it. Also want to take a moment to think all the great interpreters that helped with this interview. Many of the folks on the interview use American Sign Language or ASL to communicate. So unfortunately, American Sign Language does not translate well into the podcast format. So many of the voices you hear are actually the voices of some of the amazing interpreters that interpreted that American Sign Language so that you could hear this story for yourselves. We also are really excited to have the return of an app worth mentioning from BridgingApps. As always. We thank you for listening today, but we want to hear from you as well. So remember, you can always reach out, send us an email at tech@eastersealscrossroads.org., shoot us a line on Twitter @INDATAProject or call our listener line at (317) 721-7124. But for now, let’s go ahead and get on with a show. Jonna, take us away.

Speaker 7:
This is [ Jonna 00:02:29] with BridgingApps, and this is an app worth mentioning. This week’s featured app is called Peak Brain Training. The Peak Brain Training app features short daily workouts for your brain that focus on things like memory, coordination, language, problem solving, and more. The workouts are different each day and get more challenging as your skills improve. These short daily workouts and personalized games adapt to your skill level, helping users improve cognitive performance while in depth performance analytics track progress. Some of the great features of this app are that it sets a reminder for you to play one to seven days a week, and at a time that works for you. The activities in the app are clearly categorized by the skill that are meant to improve, allowing users to see which types of skills they are doing well in, as well as which areas they may need more practice. Lastly, one of the best features is that the activities adjust to the skill of the user in this app, allowing everyone to experience success and to be challenged to work harder.

Speaker 7:
Based upon your scores, the app will either keep you at a level or bump you up, allowing you to focus on the areas you need to keep your brain at its peak level. We think that this app is great for older adults and for anyone who wants to exercise their brain. Studies have shown that small declines in the area of memory, both visual and verbal, may occur along with some short term memory loss as you age. The brain, like any muscle, needs exercise to stay in shape. The more exercise the brain gets, the better it is at processing information. Memory exercises for seniors can help short and long term recall. Keeping your brain sharp is important throughout your lifetime. Whether you are in the stage of life where your family and caregiving responsibilities are increasing or where you are becoming less busy with work and family responsibilities. Peak Brain Training is developed by PopReach Corporation, who has also developed several other game apps for Android, Apple and Amazon devices. Peak Brain Training is currently available for both Android and iOS devices, and is free to download with optional in-app purchases. For more information on this app and others like it, visit bridgingapps.org

Josh Anderson:
Listeners, I know this may be hard to believe, but written English and sign language are not the same thing. Having written instructions is not always as beneficial to someone who is deaf as having an ASL interpreter may be. Well, today, I’m super excited and honored to introduce some very special people to you. Our Deaf Community Services department did what most people did during the pandemic. They looked at an issue that had been a problem for the deaf community for a long time. The written portion of the driver’s exam here in Indiana, and went about changing policy and practices to fix it. We’re lucky enough to have some of the parties involved joining us today to tell you all about it. All right. Well, welcome to the show, everyone. Before we get into talking about this exciting kind of program and everything that you all did, could you start us off by introducing yourselves to our listeners?

Stephanie Ritchie:
I’m Stephanie Ritchie. I’m the director of Deaf Community Services, which is a division of Easterseals Crossroads.

Jennifer Alka:
Hi, I’m Jennifer Alka, and I’m the case manager here at Deaf Community Services.

Sophia Wascher:
Hi, I’m Sophia Wascher and I’m 16. And I go to the deaf school.

Olivia Wascher:
Hi, there I am. Olivia Wascher. My sign name looks like this. I am also here at the deaf school. I’m 16.

Josh Anderson:
Awesome. Well thank you so much, everybody, for introducing yourselves to our listeners. And just so we’re listeners know, Stephanie, Jennifer, could you tell us little bit about Deaf Community Services here at Easterseals Crossroads? Kind of what all do you offer and why are you an important asset to the community?

Stephanie Ritchie:
Certainly. Well, our department offers two main service lines. We provide American Sign Language interpreting services to the deaf community all throughout the state of Indiana. And even now, we’re starting to branch out even more on a national level. And then we also provide, like Jennifer mentioned, some case management services. And so those are… We have three case workers, or I guess the case managers are more like social workers that are on staff here. And they work individually with people in the deaf community that are kind of going through a temporary crisis and just need a little bit of support and some help and guidance along the way. So those are the two main things we do is providing the case management services and then also the American Sign Language interpreting. But Jennifer, if you want to kind of elaborate a little bit more about your role as a case manager and what that might look like and what you do, you could probably talk about that better than I can.

Jennifer Alka:
Sure. Just like Stephanie had mentioned, there are three of us here that are case managers. We work very well together with deaf community. We do things like… Everybody experiences different issues and different things that need to be helped out in life. So it just depends… Well, I don’t know where to start, but really, we just start with gathering the information. We just try to help them become more independent and to be able to be in the community and give them that type of support. Our role here really varies. We do so many different things. And so it could be a surprise every single day. You never know what to expect, but we love it. It’s definitely a fun job and we love doing it here.

Josh Anderson:
Awesome. And we could probably fill an entire show with what you all do kind of for the community around here, at least in the time that I’ve been here and been able to see what you can do. But that’s not really why we’re here today. So let’s kind of start off by talking about the issue. What was the problem that you all set out to solve with the driver’s test with the BMV here in Indiana?

Jennifer Alka:
Really, I’ve been working here seven years now and, over and over again, clients would come in being very frustrated about taking the driver’s test. They want to be independent but there’s a lot of obstacles and a lot of barriers going through the BMV. So one thing was taking the driver’s test. Well, when someone would go into the driver’s test, so the BMV, the BMV would be give them a hard time saying that they had to read this paper. It was English. English is not the deaf community’s first language, so then you have to have an interpreter, figure out a way to interpret. And if you took the test and didn’t pass, you would have to actually ask for a retest. That means you’d have to wait two weeks only because they’d have to request an interpreter for that test again.

Jennifer Alka:
Well, that’s not equal access as any hearing person that would be able to go in the BMV. Take the test if they fail it the next day. They’re allowed to go back in and take it again. The deaf community wasn’t allowed to do that. And there was this so many struggles all the time, over and over again. And over the COVID pandemic, we thought this might be a good opportunity. We need to have a project to be able to focus on what we could do during that time, and that’s when we thought of the BMV here. Then we’d contacted the BMB and,, surprisingly enough, the project took off immediately. They were on board with us and here we are today, thrilled of the reason outcome that has happened at the BMV.

Josh Anderson:
Excellent. Well, this next question is actually for Olivia and Sophia. So you took the new test. I wanted to know first, had you tried to take the test before it was available in sign language?

Olivia Wascher:
This is Olivia. No, I did not actually. I took it on a screen which had the ASL interpreter. The video was a video in video. My brother actually took the test, the written test though, with a paper and there was an interpreter that came on site to interpret all of the tests. But for me, I got a little lucky. I was able to actually have the interpreter on the same screen. So it’s great.

Josh Anderson:
That’s awesome. What was that experience kind of like? Kind of just describe it. I know you said that you had them on the screen, but can you describe it to our listeners, what it looked like and how it was beneficial?

Sophia Wascher:
Well, the test, like I said, it’s typically in written English, but each question has multiple choice answers. So sometimes there are pictures and diagrams and so forth. Sometimes you have to watch a video that goes along with that. And it’s just really a big relief to be able to see ASL right there on the screen, because it’s my first language and it’s a lot more comprehensible to me than having to go through all of those English questions in my second language.

Olivia Wascher:
So very much similar to how Sophia mentioned earlier is how we take tests at school is we usually let the teacher… a teacher will go ahead and sign any of the questions, any of the content for us when we take that test. And that just feels very normal. That’s just a very easy everyday accessibility for us and what that looks like. I don’t have to fight for my accessibility needs, I don’t have to work, I don’t have to do anything. The video’s already made. If it is a video, if it’s live in class, the teacher’s there signing all the questions and answers for me.

Sophia Wascher:
Yeah. And also, yeah, with the video test, it was already there and interpreted. So I guess it’s a lot more realistic for us just to be able to walk in and take it there. I didn’t have any doubts or worries on top of having to take the test. It was just normal because it was in my language.

Jennifer Alka:
And I know Olivia and Sophia is probably hard to compare because you didn’t take that written test. So since you’ve only taken it in ASL, but I did take a paper test back in the day, and how I had to process it was that I actually… luckily, I had a good educational background. I did have a good knowledge of English, but if I didn’t have English as part of my repertoire, then, I mean, reading it when I took the test, I actually had to read it in English and, in my head, translated over to how I would be signed to be able to understand the question better, and then go back and then try to pick the right answer. And I had to do that for every single question of the test. So Olivia and Sophia, you being able to go in and just getting the test right in your language is so much easier. And I was so, so thrilled to see that you had that privilege to be able to have it in ASL instead of having to translate it from English.

Josh Anderson:
That is awesome. I can’t imagine trying to remember all the stuff that is on that written test, plus having to try to translate everything in your head, plus having to translate all the answers is, plus some of them are a little tricky. And if I remember right now, it’s been more years than I like to admit since I took the written part of the test. But if I remember right, some of the answers are, “Well, it could be this one. It could be this one.” So yeah, one little mistake in that translation in your head and, Jennifer kind of like you said, that can be just a major, major challenge and barrier. So I guess you both took the test at the right time that all this was kind of in place when you went in to be able to do that. Well, I have to ask the question that I’m sure most of our listeners will probably have when they listen to this. Did you both pass?

Sophia Wascher:
Of course.

Olivia Wascher:
Yes.

Josh Anderson:
I was very scared to ask that question here just because I was like, “Oh, if they didn’t, I’m going to have to cut that part out of the show.” Olivia, Sophia, now that you do have your driver’s license, where is the first place that you went?

Sophia Wascher:
The first place I went was Firehouse Subs to get myself a sandwich.

Olivia Wascher:
Olivia. I have not actually gone to anywhere myself. This is silly, but if I did, I’d probably drive to Colorado, do some sort of road trip. But that is probably not possible at the moment, so I’ll probably just go to some sort of ice cream place and grab some ice cream. I think that’s probably going to be my first drive.

Josh Anderson:
Oh, I love it. And Colorado sounds excellent. That’s maybe a little bit more of a drive and maybe wait till spring or summertime. You get up in those mountains, the winters can be a little harsh, so…

Olivia Wascher:
Totally.

Josh Anderson:
For sure. For sure. Well, Olivia, Sophia, I kind of want to ask you and pick your brains a little bit, just because you’re a little bit younger, and not to say anything about the rest of us being older, but where are some other places that you see that this kind of barrier where things are really just in written English and not so much available in sign language, where maybe things would be a whole lot easier if it was available in both?

Olivia Wascher:
Olivia here. I’m not sure actually

Jennifer Alka:
Sophia, remember you were speaking about the BMV when you went in and explained the experience. I think that part, too. If you want to share that story you told us earlier.

Sophia Wascher:
Sure. Yeah. The test at the BMV was great, but, yeah, when I first went into the BMV, the person who was speaking to me behind the counter and that was my first time going into the BMV and I didn’t even know they had called my number, because you take a number when you walk in and then I couldn’t hear them calling that. So I had to make sure that they would know to actually get my attention because I’m deaf. So I had to tell the people, “Please let me know when my number comes up because I don’t have any way to hear that.” So just even the sort of everyday interactions, I had to ask for special accommodations for somebody to help me out with that.

Josh Anderson:
Sure. And that’s something that I’m sure the hearing community probably wouldn’t even think of, really, and you just kind of call it out. And especially if you wait that long at the BMV, nobody wants to be passed up and kind of moved onto the next one.

Sophia Wascher:
If I can add.

Josh Anderson:
Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Sophia Wascher:
Yeah. I was also thinking that, like I said, when I went in and I told the people to let me know when my number was called also, I had to go in to get my license and I had to fill up the application for the license and the permit beforehand. And I actually missed my turn the first time, so there was a guy there who said that, “They’ve been calling your number,” and I didn’t realize. And then I went up late because I didn’t realize that they had called me. So I actually technically missed my number the first time around.

Josh Anderson:
Well, it’s nice they still kind of actually let you go. And Stephanie, Jennifer, do you see other places… I know that, again, most people were kind of learning how to bake sourdough bread and do stuff like that during COVID shutdowns and changed the way the BMV operates. So that’s thanks for making some of the listeners probably feel like they didn’t do a lot during that time. But where are some other places where you’ve had experience and/or maybe heard of folks having the same kind of experience where things are only offered in the written English or maybe even written Spanish, which doesn’t help at all, and that ASL just isn’t really available to folks? Where are some big barriers that you’ve seen?

Stephanie Ritchie:
Jennifer, you could probably talk about this.

Jennifer Alka:
Yes. Well, I am an avid flyer. I go several different places and it’s so frustrating. You have no idea when you go, they potentially might change your date while you’re on the airline. And well, luckily, now they can text message, but they can’t do that when when you’re on the flight with your phone. So I see all these people and going to a different gate and I think, “Oh, they moved the gate.” I didn’t even know because they don’t announce that. There’s no announcement. Nobody in sign language to let me know that the gate has changed. So then I just, visually, can see people move and know, “Oh gosh, something’s going on.” But now, also, I’m not allowed to sit at an exit door.

Jennifer Alka:
One time, I did sit there. They didn’t realize I was deaf. They pretty much told me to get out. I had to get out of the seat because they were afraid I didn’t know how to open a door in case of emergency. But they let foreigners sit there who do not speak English, who can, open a door. So, that’s another barrier and it’s just several different types, little things like that. I mean, normal hearing culture, people don’t even notice it, but we, in the deaf culture, we have several different barriers every single day. And so that’s just one example is at the airline and be able to take a flight.

Josh Anderson:
Yeah. And again, like you said, as a hearing individual, I wouldn’t have thought of that. And especially at the airport where there’s literally screens everywhere, I feel like it wouldn’t be that hard to just have someone pop up and kind of sign, “Now, we’re going to gate B4 or somewhere else.” But again, a lot of folks just don’t know, they don’t think about it, or there’s a huge population that just thinks the written English and sign language are the same thing, and that they just don’t realize the major differences between those two. So kind of for all of you, for our listeners who want to find out more about maybe Deaf Community Services here at Easterseals Crossroads or this project that you all completed, what’s the best way for them to do that?

Stephanie Ritchie:
I can answer that. You can reach us online at the website, it’s eastersealscrossroads.org. That would probably be the easiest way to connect with us. And then we also have our voice line (317) 479-3240, and our video phone number is (317) 493-0107.

Josh Anderson:
All right. Perfect. We’ll put that down in the show notes so the folks can easily find that in case they want to reach out and kind of find out any more information. Well, I do want to thank everyone, Jennifer, Stephanie, Olivia, Sophia, our interpreters, and everyone for coming on today and just telling us about this really cool project. There’s so many times that we see things that aren’t accessible or maybe aren’t as accessible as they should be, and we try to do what we can and sometimes it works out, sometimes it doesn’t. You saw this and it just seemed to… I know it probably didn’t go smooth behind the scenes, but you saw this. And I remember talking about it when we all started having to work from home. And then I swear I didn’t hear anything thing about it until a few months later when suddenly it was done. So, it really…

Stephanie Ritchie:
It did. It went pretty quickly. This was a rapid… Jennifer and I were speaking earlier today, thinking that a test of this magnitude or a project of this magnitude would’ve taken about three to five years. And I think because of the pandemic, everybody had so much time on their hands and they were limited in what they could do with other projects, that this project really took front and center. And so we were surprised in little… right about a year, we were able to get it done from just thinking about it, to completion, and implementing it. Rolling it out into all of the BMV branches statewide took about a year, so it was really, really cool.

Josh Anderson:
And it really was. And again, maybe that is one of the best things that came out of the pandemic was people having a little bit of extra time on their hands to be able to kind of assist and make this an actual priority, not just for those who could help but everyone making it a priority so that they could actually get it done.

Jennifer Alka:
This is Jennifer. One thing Stephanie and I talked about this morning was, with this project, we really wanted to be a model for other states. And I understand we’re probably the third state to provide videos for the ASL for the test, but we really want it to be a model for other states in the entire United States to be able to see, to be able to copy this, and to provide ASL on all of their tests too.

Stephanie Ritchie:
That’s true, Josh. Jennifer and I were talking about that earlier today and we were really hoping that this platform could help spread the word. So if somebody’s listening in another state that they could reach out to their local Bureau of Motor Vehicles and see what steps need to be taken, and hopefully this will kind of… I think Jennifer alluded to a ripple effect that once we start here, then other states will pick up and want to do the same thing and provide… A lot of the BMVs offer the test in a variety of different languages, but American Sign Language tends to be overlooked. And so making sure that the test is accessible in American Sign Language would be a huge step for equality and accessibility nationwide.

Sophia Wascher:
Also, I was going to say, going back to access, the first thing at the BMV that I experienced, I guess, was taking the test. I knew that it would be in ASL, but it’s just so much more clear to have it there on video. So yeah, I would definitely suggest that be implemented in other places too, so that everybody around the country can have the same access that we did.

Josh Anderson:
Yeah. And it definitely would. And kind of like you said, they do offer it in all these different languages, but ASL always seems to be the ones that’s overlooked. And hopefully, maybe projects like this and other things will start making that change. I will say one thing maybe during the pandemic and at least some of the folks I’ve talked to is I noticed that many news conferences and things like that seem to include an interpreter more than they did before. I don’t know if maybe there were just more news conferences so I noticed it, but it got to the point where I think people expect it now and maybe are more used to it. So hopefully, that’s something where it where people looking like, “Well, why isn’t there an interpreter there. Shouldn’t they be right there?” So hopefully, maybe that’s another change that we’ll see. Another positive, I guess, coming out of the whole thing. And Olivia and Sophia, look forward to seeing you out on the roads, driving around and everything, up around here in this area. We’ll see out there and make sure that we wave when we see out on the roads,

Olivia Wascher:
This is Olivia. I’ll just go ahead and add a little comment here as well. When Sophia and I were done with the tests and everything and finally got our permit, so many of the students, my friends, other peers were asking me about the permit test. And they actually didn’t even realize that there was an ASL video within the test. And so I was able to kind of explain that experience what that was like. And for other people, it kind of calms a lot of their nerves for a lot of my friends and peers who are nervous about taking that test. But once they knew that there was an ASL aspect to it, they’re definitely more like wanting to take it. It’s very exciting for them and they feel maybe pressure to less nervousness about actually taking the exam because they know they have that accessibility there. And I kind of went before them. I was able to explain what that looks like.

Josh Anderson:
Yeah. And you probably even talked some people into maybe taking the test earlier than they would’ve if that wasn’t an available kind of accommodation. Some folks may have hauled off or waited until they were a little bit older or something like that, but I’m glad that you kind of told them all about that so they can get in there and get more drivers out on those roads here in Indiana.

Olivia Wascher:
Totally. Yeah. Absolutely.

Josh Anderson:
But again, thank you all so much for coming on today and telling me all about your stories.

Olivia Wascher:
Sounds great.

Jennifer Alka:
Thank you so much. [crosstalk 00:26:06].

Olivia Wascher:
Thank you. Appreciate it.

Josh Anderson:
Do you have a question about assistive technology? Do you have a suggestion for someone we should interview on an assistive technology update? If so, call our listener line at (317) 721-7124. Send us an email at tech@eastersealscrossroads.org, or shoot us a note on Twitter @INDATAproject. Our captions in transcripts for the show are sponsored by the Indiana Telephone Relay Access Corporation or InTRAC. You can find out more about InTRAC at relayindiana.com. A special thanks to Nicole Preto for scheduling our amazing guests and making a mess of my schedule. Today’s show was produced, edited, hosted, and fad over by yours truly. The opinions expressed by our guest are their own and may or may not reflect those of the INDATA Project, Easterseals Crossroads, our supporting partners, or this host. This was your assistive technology update. And I’m Josh Anderson with the INDATA Project at Easterseals Crossroads in beautiful Indianapolis, Indiana. We look forward to seeing you next time.